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Something I just realized.
Topic Started: Mar 12 2011, 03:35 AM (3,020 Views)
Saberoph
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Well if Piccolo and Tien didn't speak alike, then he wouldn't have replied to Tien's comment like he did, The Namek proved he understood Tien without any issues.

It's very hard to understand someone if they don't speak alike in any way.

Here's the full quote.

Vol 13, 55.
Context: Tien talks about where he measures up.
Tenshinhan: ”In-incredible…What strength…S-so that’s a Super Saiyan…He’s in a completely different dimension than we are…Too different…”
Piccolo: “…I wonder…”
Batman Arkham Games Discussion.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8487015/1/
Q&A With Me.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8408853/1/
Dragon Ball Game Talk.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8410747/1/
Dragon Ball Game Talk 2.0
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8543860/1/
My Broli Idea.
http://dbzf.co.uk/single/?p=8716209&t=8374201
Dragon Ball Paramountcy.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8561069/1/

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Quote:
 
What you don't seem to get is that Tien and Piccolo are not the same people, and they'd not speak using the same figure of speeches. Prove that Tien saying worlds metaphorically would mean the same as Piccolo saying dimensions metaphorically.

Saying that our dimension are too far apart is not a common figure of speech. Saying that it's like he's/she's in another dimension is, but from a figure of speech standpoint the former isn't really used that often. Why would Piccolo use such an awkward figure of speech?


Conclusion: Tien and Piccolo are not the same person, and the burden of proof would be on you to prove that Piccolo was speaking figuratively when a literal meaning is just as accurate.


In addition, Tien was using words like "as if". Piccolo is speaking in more absolute terms, he literally states that their dimensions are too far apart, not that it feels as if it is. This implies a more literal meaning, ie that the Supreme Kai is the technical ruler of the universe and Piccolo at his authoritative peak was guardian of Earth.

Tenshinhan said it straightforward just like Piccolo plenty of times, and so did the narrator on Freeza. It's a Toriyama way of portraying strength differences, as he himself has also said it like that in an interview about an artist. That still hasn't changed. Not to mention you're still ignoring the Daizenshuu entry supporting my stance, and the question of why Piccolo wouldn't obey Kaioshin if he respected him as much as you're saying he did.
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FPSSJGohan
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Proof? Your quotes show Tien using the phrase as if, while Piccolo used absolute terms.
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FPSSJGohan
Mar 20 2011, 03:52 AM
Proof? Your quotes show Tien using the phrase as if, while Piccolo used absolute terms.
Chapter 341 (DBZ 147), P6.2-3
Context: as Goku fights No.19
Tenshinhan: ”In-incredible…What strength…S-so that’s a Super Saiyan…He’s in a completely different dimension than we are…Too different…”

He doesn't say "as if" here.

Chapter: 306 (DBZ 112), P9.5
Narrator: “Piccolo and the other two seemed paralyzed from their fear of Freeza, whose battle power was in a completely different dimension, and they couldn’t even move…”

The narrator also speaks in absolute terms.

Chapter: 501 (DBZ 307), P12.6
Context: as Boo is about to blow up the planet
Tenshinhan: “Da…damn it…! Our di-dimensions are too different…! I can’t be of any use…!”

He still doesn't use "as if."
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Saberoph
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Pyro, you shouldn't waste the effort in posting it, he'll just make up more excuses to back out of this one too. It's like talking to a wall.

Gohan you're so desperate, that since you were losing this debate in another Topic you had to bring it in here, then use the excuse you can't talk about Z #17 without talking about The Namek, Yakon and East Kaioshin too.

That's just BS, this is GT #17 NOT Z. GT makes everyone stronger who shouldn't be for no reason.

But Pyro is right.

Vol 13, 55.
Context: Tien talks about where he measures up.
Tenshinhan: ”In-incredible…What strength…S-so that’s a Super Saiyan…He’s in a completely different dimension than we are…Too different…”
Piccolo: “…I wonder…”

So, please point out where in that quote the two words "as if" is. I'm singling out that post, because you did and The Namek agreed.
Batman Arkham Games Discussion.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8487015/1/
Q&A With Me.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8408853/1/
Dragon Ball Game Talk.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8410747/1/
Dragon Ball Game Talk 2.0
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8543860/1/
My Broli Idea.
http://dbzf.co.uk/single/?p=8716209&t=8374201
Dragon Ball Paramountcy.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8561069/1/

Intellectual savior of the masses.
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FPSSJGohan
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I'll respond to this more asap, but for now I'll use the same argument you did:

Well we both have our opinions, so I guess it's a tie!

Hey, argue trolling all you want, but that's exactly what you said too, so you'd be a huge hypocrite.

Hopefully you'll realize the flaws of the "it's an opinion!" tactic.
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Saberoph
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How about we leave each topic to their own Topic, but I seriously doubt you'll do that, because that involves admitting you were wrong, and admitting defeat.
Batman Arkham Games Discussion.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8487015/1/
Q&A With Me.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8408853/1/
Dragon Ball Game Talk.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8410747/1/
Dragon Ball Game Talk 2.0
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8543860/1/
My Broli Idea.
http://dbzf.co.uk/single/?p=8716209&t=8374201
Dragon Ball Paramountcy.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8561069/1/

Intellectual savior of the masses.
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* -Zero-
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Black Knight

Hey guys cut it out. You have a problem to each other take it to PM, stop ruining the topics for everyone else.


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Saberoph
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I'm just trying to prove a point with the Manga quotes, and with the Diaz too. But f/e.

@Gohan, as long as you're willing to, I'm willing to drop everything, throw it out of the window and start from scratch...not just in here either. It might just be best anyway.

Let me try this once again...

Back to topic: For all we know, got by GT logic #17 could very well be equal to Hell Fighter 17.
Edited by Saberoph, Mar 20 2011, 08:16 PM.
Batman Arkham Games Discussion.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8487015/1/
Q&A With Me.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8408853/1/
Dragon Ball Game Talk.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8410747/1/
Dragon Ball Game Talk 2.0
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8543860/1/
My Broli Idea.
http://dbzf.co.uk/single/?p=8716209&t=8374201
Dragon Ball Paramountcy.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8561069/1/

Intellectual savior of the masses.
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FPSSJGohan
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Could is a keyword here. You were claiming a plot hole by asking why Trunks could take on yakon but not android 17. But yakon is actually weaker than 17, because 17 took on a super Namek and wtf pwned two ssj's, pre kami Piccolo and the humans at once. Yakon is quite a bit weaker than base buu saga Goku, who wasn't really being serious.
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Saberoph
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But the problem with that is, the Manga shows East Kaioshin to be stronger than The Namek, but he shows fear towards Yakon which is backed up by the Diaz. And in DBZ if you're afraid of someone, then you're weaker than him/her. I'm just saying by going by GT logic, and if we go by that they do either two things.

1. Make someone stronger than they're suppose to be.
2. They're weaker when it's time for Goku to save the day, but is either stronger or equal to their Z self when Goku isn't around.

But I'm glad that you said something...it's given me an idea on a topic in the DB section...Thanks.

Batman Arkham Games Discussion.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8487015/1/
Q&A With Me.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8408853/1/
Dragon Ball Game Talk.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8410747/1/
Dragon Ball Game Talk 2.0
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8543860/1/
My Broli Idea.
http://dbzf.co.uk/single/?p=8716209&t=8374201
Dragon Ball Paramountcy.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8561069/1/

Intellectual savior of the masses.
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Saberoph
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Ok, maybe this time we can continue this Topic again without anymore problems...

Where does everyone stand with GT No. 17's Strength?
Batman Arkham Games Discussion.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8487015/1/
Q&A With Me.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8408853/1/
Dragon Ball Game Talk.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8410747/1/
Dragon Ball Game Talk 2.0
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8543860/1/
My Broli Idea.
http://dbzf.co.uk/single/?p=8716209&t=8374201
Dragon Ball Paramountcy.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8561069/1/

Intellectual savior of the masses.
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Saberoph
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I realize I triple posted...my bad.

Ok, as for Trunks getting slapped around by GT No. 17. We know Trunks is haxed because it's GT, but by how much is he haxed?
Batman Arkham Games Discussion.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8487015/1/
Q&A With Me.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8408853/1/
Dragon Ball Game Talk.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8410747/1/
Dragon Ball Game Talk 2.0
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8543860/1/
My Broli Idea.
http://dbzf.co.uk/single/?p=8716209&t=8374201
Dragon Ball Paramountcy.
http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8561069/1/

Intellectual savior of the masses.
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